Are Shiva, Rama and Krishna Aryan or Dravidian deities?

Aryans created Sanskrit. That’s what some History books say. They apparently combined their own Vedic language and many existing Prakrits (natural languages) like Pali, Maharashtri and Magadhi that were spoken by Dravidians.

At first they just wrote down things that had been handed down orally by their forefathers. Then they translated Dravidian Tamil texts into Sanskrit. That’s supposed to be why Rama and Krishna, both dark-skinned Gods belonging to Tamil lore, have been worshipped all over India for generations, even by people who aren’t supposed to be descended from Dravidians.

Religion in ancient times was a mixture of animistic beliefs of the pre-Dravidian tribes, Shiva worship of Dravidians,  Jain teachings (that came down from the time of Rishaba, the first tirthankara who lived about 9000 years ago) and worship of nature gods of the Aryans.

Interestingly, Rama apparently lived around 10,000 B.C., and Krishna around 5000 B.C. Places mentioned in the Ramayana as being forested appear in the Mahabharata as urbanised! However, there are many unproven theories about where Mathura and Dwarka were in Krishna’s time, and the same goes for Lanka in Rama’s time.

There are no architectural remains of Aryan-built cities. One explanation given is that they used only wood for construction. Why would they do that when they had seen what Dravidian technology had achieved, if the two civilisations had indeed met? They apparently admired their culture enough to translate their literary works into Sanskrit, and adopted quite a lot of their religious beliefs.

All these bits and pieces that I have picked up from various sources just don’t come together coherently. I have to join the dots. I’m quite convinced that there was no Aryan invasion. There may have been waves of migration into India, and racial mixing, over thousands of years. Genetic studies show that all Indians – with the exception of the populations of the north-eastern states and some people in Jammu and Kashmir – are a mix of Ancestral North Indian and Ancestral South Indian, the proportions varying among different ethnic groups.

Another interesting tidbit I came across is that there was considerable trade between India and the Mediterranean world thousands of years ago, both by land and by sea. For example, Hebrew sources mention that the king of Tyre (now in Lebanon) sent a ship to Sophir (their name for South India) every three years to bring back gold, ivory, monkeys, peacocks, sandalwood and precious stones. So the kophim in the Bible is kapi from the Dravidian, and the Greek orydsa, or rice, is the Tamil arisi!

One thought on “Are Shiva, Rama and Krishna Aryan or Dravidian deities?

  1. In 1856, Alexander Cunningham, later director-general of the Archaeological Survey of Northern India was the first man to discover Indus Valley Civilization.

    Around 5000 years old Indus Valley civilization had the system of underground drainage & Toilets. The main sewer, 1.5 meters deep and 91 cm across, connected to many north-south and east-west sewers. It was made from bricks smoothened and joined together seamlessly. The expert masonry kept the sewer watertight. Drops at regular intervals acted like an automatic cleaning device.
    A wooden screen at the end of the drains held back solid wastes. Liquids entered a cess poll made of radial bricks. Tunnels carried the waste liquids to the main channel connecting the dockyard with the river estuary. Commoner houses had baths and drains that emptied into underground soakage jars. It was world’s first known urban sewage system. And they had a first man made huge swimming pool.

    When British arrived in India, Indians had absolutely no clue what toilet is. Even to this date, nearly 50% Indians don’t use toilets.
    This gives you a tantalizing hint about how Indus valley civilization was destroyed with an absolute impunity.

    Max Müller & Rig Veda:

    The main reason why Brahmins & other upper castes people hated Max Müller and his Aryan Invasion Theory is because it simply put them under the Invaders list such as Arabs, Mughals, Turks, Afghans and other central Asian invaders. And Brahmins always portrayed themselves as they are the native inhabitants of India since the creation.

    In mid-20th century archaeologist Mortimer Wheeler, who interpreted the presence of many unburied corpses found in the top levels of Mohenjo-daro as the victims of conquest wars, and who famously stated that the god “Indra stands accused” of the destruction of the Civilization. Most of the present North Indians burn the dead bodies traditionally whereas Indus Valley people clearly followed burial systems and there is no evidence of burning the dead bodies found in Indus valley. This indicates that they are different from present people of North India.

    Here is the Prof. Max Muller’s translation of Rig Veda.
    Based his translation on the work of Sayana who was a prime minister at Vijayanagar Empire., Karnataka.
    In Rig Veda, there is a word called Dasyu, Sanskrit dāsa (“servant”), an aboriginal people in India who were encountered by the Indo-European-speaking peoples who entered northern India about 1500 BCE. They were described in Rig Veda as a dark-skinned, flat nose, harsh-spoken people who worshipped the phallus (Shivling?).

    In Rig veda, Purandara is another name of Indra. Pura means city and dara means destroyer, so purandhara means destroyer of cities.
    The verses of the Rig Veda says “Armed cattle raids & warriors on horse driven chariots attacking walled cities & forts in search of wealth.”
    Rig veda portays the invaders as a light skinned race fighting the dark skinned natives (Adivasi).

    Ibn Book 2: HYMN 11, 4 we who add strength to thine own splendid vigour, laying within thine arms the splendid thunder. With us mayst thou, O Indra, waxen splendid, with Surya overcome the Dasa Races.” ” Oh Indra you killed and chased out the black skinned short people from Indus”

    In the Rig Veda the Dasa&Dasyu are one of the worst enemies of the Aryans(arka/sun/day). The Aryans called them “anasah” (flatnose/noseless) “krishnatvac” (darkskinned) etc. Hence it was suggested that the Arya & Dasyu fights indicate the fight for the land between the invading fair skinned Aryans and the dark skinned aborigines.

    Religion:
    All the religion on this earth are manmade.
    In Ancient days, Most men were used to be crooked, wicket, cruel, greedy, selfish and fickle minded by nature. And they are as group, very difficult to control them.
    So their leader or group of leaders used religion as tool to control them by putting fear of god in their mind (Heaven & Hell type of concepts).
    And leaders implemented certain social norms and practices in the name of God on the society which they felt good and can control their people.

    Below are some of the examples will make it clear that only Brahmins must have written Hinduism before they went on to adopt local tribal deities such as Krishna, Shiva, Rama, Venkatesha, Ayyappa etc to Hinduism. They placed themselves at the top of the Caste System while the dark skinned Dravidians and Adivasis were placed lower in the caste system. There was continuous gene flow in both directions during more egalitarian Buddhist period when the caste system was weakened but it was later reinforced by the Hindu Gupta Empire. Nearly all the Hindu gods and goddesses are dark skinned as they were originally worshipped by the dark skinned aboriginal Adivasis and later by the Dravidians.
    In Ancient India, It was caste which decides what profession you should do and what type lifestyle one must lead. Initially it was the VARNA (Skin Color) which decided your caste.
    “Brahmins Varna was white, Kshtriyas was red, Vaishyas was yellow, and the Shudras’ black” source Rig Veda.
    Veda’s say that God Created Brahmins from his head, Kshatriyas from his chest, Vaishyas from his stomach and Shudras from his Foot. Brahmins were given Sattva Guna: Knowledge, purity, and happiness (14:6).
    It also says that Sudras the lowest of four classes, were born in an “inferior womb” (Papayonaya, 9:32) because of the combination of their Tamas Guna (inherent traits such as ignorance, delusion, heedlessness, indolence and sleep, 14:8), and some sinful acts they must have committed in his previous lives, such as hitting a Brahmin or stealing his cow. If a Sudra wished to be reborn in a higher class, he should keep performing his Dharma (designated duty of serving the upper classes) helplessly (18:60) and faithfully in this life (18:45).
    Ostracism by the society was considered worse than death (2:34).

    Sanskrit:
    Sanskrit is a symbol of Indian slavery to Aryan invasion and reminds us Syrian nationalism and not Indian Nationalism.
    Sanskrit was first recorded in inscriptions found not on the plains of India but in what is now northern Syria. Sanskrit was known & spoken only by few elites in Brahmins community throughout Indian History which is hardly 1% or 2% of total Indian population. Rest of the population has no idea what it was.
    Only the Dravidian languages to some extent reflects Indian Nationalism!
    Sanskrit never originated in India. It belongs to Indo European Language which scholars believe that it originated somewhere ancient Anatolia (present-day Turkey).
    Sanskrit was brought from outside invaders, that is the reason why Indus Valley Civilization scripts are still not deciphered in spite of putting so many efforts to decipher it.

    Below are some of the evidences found:
    Firstly, in the documents of the Kassite rulers of Babylon (c. 1750 BC–1170 BC) there is reference of two gods’ viz. Suriya (sun god) and Marutta (god of war) and a King called Abiratta (Abhiratha).

    Secondly, there was a Mittani Kingdom in the North-West of Babylon in 1500 to 1300BC in which some documents list the names of princes and noblemen. Some of them are Indrota (Indra), Sauksatra, Purusa etc.

    Thirdly, the most important evidence comes from the Boghazkoi tablet inscription found in eastern Turkey. These inscriptions record the details of a treaty signed in around 1350BC between the losers Mittani and victors Hitties. Both the sides have listed their Gods. The Gods of Mittani are Indra, Varuna, Nasatya etc. which are clearly Rig-Vedic. In Rig-Veda, these Gods have been assigned the task of overseeing the treaties. Kikkuli’s horse training text includes technical terms such as aika (eka, one), tera (tri, three), panza (pancha, five), satta (sapta, seven), na (nava, nine), vartana (vartana, turn, round in the horse race). The numeral aika “one” is of particular importance because it places the superstrate in the vicinity of Indo-Aryan proper as opposed to Indo-Iranian or early Iranian (which has “aiva”) in general. Another text has babru (babhru, brown), parita (palita, grey), and pinkara (pingala, red). Their chief festival was the celebration of the solstice (vishuva) which was common in most cultures in the ancient world. The Mitanni warriors were called marya, the term for warrior in Sanskrit as well; note mišta-nnu (= miẓḍha,~ Sanskrit mīḍha) “payment (for catching a fugitive)”.

    Sanskritic interpretations of Mitanni royal names render Artashumara (artaššumara) as Arta-smara “who thinks of Arta/Ṛta”, Biridashva (biridašṷa, biriiašṷa) as Prītāśva “whose horse is dear”, Priyamazda (priiamazda) as Priyamedha “whose wisdom is dear”, Citrarata as citraratha “whose chariot is shining”, Indaruda/Endaruta as Indrota “helped by Indra”, Shativaza (šattiṷaza) as Sātivāja “winning the race price”, Šubandhu as Subandhu “having good relatives”, Tushratta (tṷišeratta, tušratta, etc.) as *tṷaiašaratha, Vedic Tvastr “whose chariot is vehement”.

    The fact that Sanskrit alone has retroflex sounds borrowed from Dravidian and loanwords from Munda, Dravidian etc. not found in European languages suggests strongly that the ancestor of Sanskrit is an immigrant to India.

    Saraswati River:

    Rig veda is a version of Iranian or Aryan “Vendida ” a text of Zoroastrian. The oldest name mentioned of this river in Avesta is Haraxvaiti, a cognate to Sanskrit Saraswati River. Hence it is Helmand River which is mentioned in Rig Veda as Saraswati River.
    Pre-Zoroastrianism considers Asuras as good and Devas as bad which is inverse of the Rig Vedic beliefs.
    This indicates that they were two rival tribes one in present day Iran and another one in present day somewhere in Afghanistan. May be it was same tribe much before later got split.

    Linguistic and literary evidence provide us with very important clues. The closeness in grammar, vocabulary and phonetics between Sanskrit and major European languages (especially Greek and Latin) suggests that ancestors of their speakers must have lived together in the remote past. This joint Indo-European homeland has been placed in the Eurasian steppes. Furthermore, there is a remarkable degree of closeness between the Rigveda and the Zoroastrian sacred text Avesta, not only in language but also in mythology and religious concepts. The peoples of the Rigveda and Avesta referred to themselves as Aryan. The 19th-century German scholarship used the term Aryan to denote the ‘race’ of Indo-European speakers. With the Nazi holocaust, the term fell into disrepute. It is considered more appropriate to use linguistic indicators. Thus, we talk about Indo-European speakers, of whom Indo-Iranians constituted a sub-group. It is surmised that various linguistic groups dispersed from the homeland into Europe and southwards into Iran, Afghanistan and North India. Indic speakers moved into India after the collapse of the mature Harappan phase. Whether there was a migration or an invasion is a mere matter of detail. The key point is that the Rigvedic People were not Harrapans.

    River Sarasvati is described in detail as a mighty river, in the old books (mandalas) of the Rigveda. It is noteworthy that rivers Sarasvati, Sarayu and the land Sapata-Sindhu appears in the Avesta in equivalent forms. It has been received wisdom for a long time that the Sarasvati of the old mandalas (naditama Sarasvati) is to be identified with the Old Ghaggar. Ghaggar today is a small river, in the land between Satluj and Yamuna that loses its way in the desert. There is incontrovertible evidence that in the past, things were different. Both Satluj and Yamuna flowed into Ghaggar and the combined waters flowed into the Arabian Sea. It must be borne in mind that contrary to popular misconception, SATELLITE imagery confirms the existence of Old Ghaggar but does not (cannot) provide any chronological information. It is very likely that the Ghaggar system has been in its present pitiable state for say 10000 or 20000 years. More fundamentally, the old Ghaggar cannot match the Rigvedic attributes of the mighty Sarasvati. The waters of snow-fed Satluj and Yamuna will make Lower Ghaggar a mighty river, but Upper Ghaggar will still be as it is now, a small rain-fed rivulet. It is noteworthy that there is an uncanny similarity between the Rigvedic description of Sarasvati and Avestan description of Helmand (old name Haetumant=Setumant). Rigveda (6.61.8) talks of Sarasvati ‘whose limitless unbroken flood, swiftly moving with a rapid rush, comes onward with a tempestuous roar’, while Yasht (10.67) refers to ‘the bountiful, glorious Haetumant swelling its white waves rolling down its copious floods’. This suggests that the same river is meant in both cases.

    It is very likely that the Ghaggar system has been in its present pitiable state for say 10000 or 20000 years. More fundamentally, the old Ghaggar cannot match the Rigvedic attributes of the mighty Sarasvati. The waters of snow-fed Satluj and Yamuna will make Lower Ghaggar a mighty river, but Upper Ghaggar will still be as it is now, a small rain-fed rivulet. It is noteworthy that there is an uncanny similarity between the Rigvedic description of Sarasvati and Avestan description of Helmand (old name Haetumant=Setumant). Rigveda (6.61.8) talks of Sarasvati ‘whose limitless unbroken flood, swiftly moving with a rapid rush, comes onward with a tempestuous roar’, while Yasht (10.67) refers to ‘the bountiful, glorious Haetumant swelling its white waves rolling down its copious floods’. This suggests that the same river is meant in both cases.

    Genetics:
    Bloodlines have connected the dots ( Science as in Genetics )
    There is “general agreement” that north and south Indians share a common maternal ancestry which indicates that those who invaded Indus Valley were only Men and later interbred with local population. A series of studies show that the Indian subcontinent harbors two major ancestral components namely the Ancestral North Indians (ANI) which is “genetically close to Middle Easterners, Central Asians, and Europeans”, and the Ancestral South Indians (ASI) which is clearly distinct from ANI. These two groups mixed in India between 4,200 and 1,900 years ago (2200 BCE-100 CE), where after a shift to endogamy took place, possibly by the enforcement of “social values and norms” by the “Hindu Gupta rulers”.

    The first steps ever by genetic science into the Harappan space, both studies are based on DNA samples taken from those same burials at Rakhigarhi.
    Importantly, the R1a genetic marker, typical of the Western Central Asian Steppes, is missing in the Rakhigarhi sample.
    “The Rakhigarhi samples have a significant amount of ‘Iranian farmer’ ancestry. You won’t find this DNA in the north Indian population today, but only in south Indians,” said Niraj Rai, head of the Ancient DNA lab at Lucknow’s Birbal Sahni Institute for Palaeosciences. He also said ““We aren’t getting any Central Asian gene flow in Rakhigarhi. Comparing Rakhigarhi with data from modern Indian populations, we have concluded that they have more of an affinity with the Ancestral South Indian tribal population compared to the north Indian population.”
    Some people argue that there was no Aryan Invasion. If there was no invasion why is there only a relationship in “male” DNA (y-chromosome) between Indians and the other indoeuropean people? Only 17% of Indians carry the indoeuropean male dna signature. But in the west there are populations where the share is almost 100% and no trace of the ancient indian male DNA (DNA that would correspond to the ancestors of the Dravidian part of the Indian population) can be found anywhere to the West of the Indian subcontinent. Why is the indoeuropean DNA only found in the upper castes?
    The Aryan invasion theory is uniformly and categorically accepted at every single university of international repute and there is no serious scholar in the field of Indo-European Studies who thinks otherwise.

    Who built Indus Valley Civilization?
    Many scholars believe that Neolithic Iranians (Iranian Agriculturalists)/Elamites got mixed with South Asian Hunter Gatherers and formed I.V.C.
    Every Historian who specialized in Indian History knows that before the Aryans entered India , The Elamites had entered India.
    Some claim that it was Dravidian culture.
    Meluḫḫa is the Sumerian name of a prominent trading partner of Sumer during the Middle Bronze Age. Most scholars associate it with the Indus Valley Civilization.
    Many scholars today who confidently identify Meluhha with the Indus Valley Civilization (modern South Asia) on the basis of the extensive evidence of trading contacts between Sumer and this region. Sesame oil was probably imported from the Indus River region into Sumer: the Sumerian word for this oil is illu (Akkadian: ellu). One theory is that the word is of proto-Dravidian origin: in Dravidian languages of South India, el or ellu stands for sesame. An alternative, proposed by Michael Witzel, is that it derived from a “para-Munda” language spoken in the Indus Valley Civilization.

    There is extensive presence of Harappan seals and cubical weight measures in Mesopotamian urban sites. Specific items of high volume trade are timber and specialty wood such as ebony, for which large ships were used. Luxury items also appear, such as lapis lazuli mined at a Harappan colony at Shortugai (modern Badakhshan in northern Afghanistan), which was transported to Lothal, a port city in Gujarat in western India, and shipped from there to Oman, Bahrain and Sumer.

    The Dravidians began in south-eastern Iran when Elamites migrating from the west (Khuzistan area) mixed with Eritrean Africans who had settled in the Ormozgan area. These African settlers had crossed Southern Arabia to get to south-eastern Iran and were absorbed by the Elamite migrants, becoming a new people called the Dravidians. The Dravidians migrated to the Indus River valley in 7000 BC, where they mixed further with Nihalis and Adivasis, and later the Mundas. They spread out to occupy the entire Indian sub-continent, but were later confined to the southern part when the Indo-Aryans arrived in India around 1300 BC.

    Where did the Elamites come from? In 18,000 BC, the Kebarans (Proto-Boreans) arrived in Mesopotamia from the Horn of Africa. In 15,000 BC they split into the Nostratics, the Dene-Daics, the Afro-Asiatics, and the Amerinds. Around 12,000 BC, the Nostratics split into the Elamites, the Kartvelians, and the Eurasiatics (ancestors of the Indo-Europeans, and many others). The Dravidians branched off from the Elamites around 7000 BC.
    The Elamitic language does resembles Dravidian. Mr.David McAlpin (Researcher) has made a demonstration based on 57 Elamite words (mostly verb stems) paired with corresponding Dravidian terms. The correspondences are, on the whole, straightforward and interlocking. A beginning is made in reconstructing the phonology of Proto-Elamo-Dravidian.
    Below are some of the examples.

    Elamites Dravidian Meaning
    Un Unnu Eat/Drink
    Vur Uru Place
    Atta Attan Father
    Slive Shiluve Holy Cross
    Amma Amma Mother
    Kol Kollu Kill
    Ah Ah That
    Hih Ih This
    Illu Ellu Sesame
    Elam Elam Land
    Ni Ninu You

    Even Lord Krishna was from Elamite clan or at least has close affinity with Elamites.
    Kiririsha was Elamite God. Below us the link:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiririsha

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